Feral Avatars. We need them., A discussion about Ferals and avatars. Options

[Guest_Langolas Grond_*]

I'm an excellent idea person!

Idea 1: It would be easier if there were feral avatars. I was reading that more hybrid avatars thread and there was a good point made. It takes a lot of work and effort to make avatars, including winged ones. But with ferals, they are already patches made for ferals. You can use those. And ferals wouldn't need wings.

More ideas to come!        

[Anosuke]

I don't mean to come down on you, but feral's kind of go against the Furcadia....um....what is it called??........Theme!  That's it!  (Sorry, seriously forgot for a minute there.)  On the Furcadia.com page, you'll clearly see that the beginning words are....

 FURCADIA:  What are we all about?

Furcadia is the magical world where the animals have learned to walk upon two legs and speak.

No offense intended, but I think it's better if ferals are kept within private dreams.  Gryffe's have a feral form.  So maybe more digo avatars with feral transformations would be a good idea.
Anyways, just my 2 1/2 cents.

[Cassiel]

There ARE already patches for ferals out there.  -YOU- COULD go ahead and use them to save time if you don't want to make your own.  Whup!  Problem solved!  I'm so awesome.

[Guest_Jin Kiuchi_*]

But..but...that's so simple...what about for all the nonlinear thinkers? ;-;

[Youlanda]

We don't NEED feral avatars.

Furcadia has survived for what... eight years without feral avatars.

I wouldn't mind Feral Avatars if nonferals had the option to do a `noferals command which makes all feral avatars explode, become walkable, ignore all feral players and automatically ban them from dreams of `noferal players.

[BassMan the II]

Ferals: the worst fad to hit Furcadia since cabbits and the reason I didn't attend The Wolf Howl



This post has been edited by BassMan the II: Nov 21 2003, 11:24 AM

[Guest_Jin Kiuchi_*]

Ferals are yummy with the proper sauces, BRING ON THE FERALS 8B

[Anosuke]

If you want to see ferals roaming around Furcadia, take a feral player patch and put it in place of the default player.fsh in your Furcadia folder.

[FaolinBainin]

I wasn't going to post but I suppose another opinion wont hurt.

First of all, four-legged versions of Furcadia's furres are not out of continutity. It's called the bestial form of the were-furre.

Of course... how many of us even stick completely to the dragonlands theme? Pheonixes and Gryffes go against this theme themselves if I'm not mistaken. So I think it would be worth the money it would raise to add another digo option that turned your avatar into a four-legged version.

Let's not call it 'feral' because I'm not talking only about users who rp creatures that are like that 24/7. The term in itself seems to attract resentment.

Surely there are enough users who would like  to see it happen to justify the update. Not all of whom are roleplayers, 'ferals' or so called 'fad-followers'... and like Langolas said, there is plenty of available art that I'm sure would be happily donated as to releave any stress from the pixels.

No we don't NEED four-legged avatars, but many of us would LIKE them.

[Irriel]

Personally, I see ferals as good NPC's.... not good PC's.... a good feral is one that acts like the real-world animal. Which means it's emotions should be nearly unreadable, if it has any at all. RPing ferals = bad.

[Cave]

Even though four-legged animals occasionally make an appearence in my own RP continuity, it's the last public avatar I'd personally like to see added to the game. However, Faolin makes a very good point - feral avatars are in huge demand. It's not just a fad either, fad-criers. They've been around since the start.

Not that user demand appears to have much bearing on Furc's updates.

[Youlanda]

In the Dragonlands Continuity Lycans are feared and hated and would be hunted to death upon sight.

Dragons and Phonexes do fit the Furcadia theme because Furcadia has two themes. All of the "furry" (animals that have fur) on Furcadia are bi-pedal anthromorphic mammals that can talk. All of the paid non-furred animals are bi-pedal anthropomprhic creatures of legend, "Mystics". Dragones, Phoenixes, Gryphons.

Anthromorphic is something with human-like qualities. Bi-pedal means to walk on two legs.

You'd be more likely to see a Taur avatar than a feral avatar because a taur is somewhat mystic, a feral is not. We see unevolved animals every day, there is nothing mystical, magical, etc about it.

Ferals do, to some extent, ruin the fantasy flare of Furcadia. It would additionally cause problems for roleplay places that disallow ferals.  

Ferals do not walk on two legs and if played correctly they do not talk either. People that roleplay ferals roleplay them wrong, if they were roleplaying them right they'd get bored and play something else.

Why should DEP break its theme and make unevolved avatars (I assume of each avatar already in existence, nine or so) a small minute faction of fad hopers and bad roleplayers, a special interest group, gets their own avatars?

Should we add drow avatars for the drow special interest group even though it goes against the theme?
Should we add Human avatars for the human special interest group even though it goes against the theme?

Nothing is stopping Feral players from making dreams and using patches, the patches are already available.

By adding feral avatars, not only will DEP be destroying their own themes but they'll also be adding more load time to the game and making it more difficult for dreams that are actually be forcing the ferals on places that actually stick to the Furcadia theme making those that actually follow the theme have to work harder to protect their dreams from ferals. They might even lose a few players, maybe some that actually support Furcadia.

I'd like to see a poll amongst paying players on Furcadia (silver sponsors, dragons, wings, phoenixes, gryphons) and see what they think of the idea.

Players playing with Feral avatars would probably find an increasing amount of dreams with DS that detects what avatars they're wearing and ejects them immediately with a message of "Your kind isn't welcome here."

Fact of the matter is though... DEP already has selected which avatars to add next. Skunks top the list, followed by cows, deer, bugges (furc dragonlands theme item) and byrddes (which I think is also a dragonland themed item). I'm certain that bears have been added to that list as they are not only in high demand but also meet the Furcadia theme. Until the above listed avatars are added to Furcadia it is rather pointless to even bother to suggest adding any other avatars for it will probably fall on deaf ears.

From Talz's FAQ:
http://www.realtime.net/~pixel/a/#A20

20. "Could you add [this new Race] to Furcadia?"
--Furcadia has so few Races because every new Race adds considerably to the size of the download. Every second longer it goes is a moment in which the download might fail. If that happens, the downloader is more than 50% likely to give up on Furcadia forever.
The ones we have were chosen by going over FurryMUCK data. These six covers over 95% of FurryMUCK's population. If the Internet itself changes such that bandwidth is MUCH higher for even the slowest users, then we can consider adding others. My list is topped Skunks (stretchable for squirrels, etc.), Cows, Deer, Bugges, and Avians ("Byrddes").
Although I normally appreciate input, your suggestion for what to add next will probably fall on deaf ears until all five of the above are completed and added.

In short, make a dream, wait, and don't waste your breath.



This post has been edited by Youlanda: Nov 22 2003, 10:59 AM

[FaolinBainin]

Yes Lycans are feared and hunted, but still part of the continuity. I meant to suggest that they could be implemented along the lines of wings and dragons, therefore only effecting the basic six avatars we have now (not their digo counterparts). I don't know if that was miunderstood. It would be like the gryffes special feature. Two-legged gone four-legged at the press of a button. It makes the character a were-furre.

As far as the mythical theme for paid avatars goes...
From the list of Prime transformations:

3. Bestial Form.
This is a horse-sized quadrupedal shape whose purpose is swift travel.  Other than the Bestial Forms, "dumb" four-footed versions of animals don't really exist. (Incidentally, Furre mythology *does* have the "werecreature" concept.  Werefurres are always poor souls doomed to turn into mad ravening quadrupedal versions of themselves, and murder those closest to them.)

Were-furres can be assumed to fall under the Mythical category. Their ties to the primes are quite apparent.

It is not necessary to blatantly insult an entire group.

Yes we know adding avatars increases load time. Of course, new avatars will be implemented none the less.
As far as dream owners who would feel it necessary to implement ds that ejects such users from their dream are concerned... isn't the ignore command then a manual eject good enough to use for those users who, after learning that only certain types are allowed in the in-dream continuity, proceed to ignore it? Surely it's pointless to eject someone who doesn't mean to offend?

Yes it might cause a couple people to quit. Allowing repeated rude comments on the forums might also cause users to quit. It happens unfortunately. Not everyone will be satisfied with everything.
And yes I would like to see a poll too, but for the furcadia community at large, not just those who happen to like the current available paid-for features enough to buy them.

Yes there is an older list of which avatars we should expect next. However, it is because people ask for it that DEP knows it is something to consider.

'If people want to take the time to suggest it, let them.'



This post has been edited by FaolinBainin: Nov 22 2003, 10:07 PM

[Youlanda]

So you think that it is fair to allow special interest groups to have their avatars?

I want hunter avatars with special shooting animation so I can shoot the feral avatars with brain exploding action. If the feral players get special avatars why can't the anti-feral players get special avatars too? And humans? And drow? And Elves? And giant penii? Heck, I bet some of the FurNers would love a giant walking penis avatar with WINGS!

If ferals were added Furc would basically be breaking its own theme entirely just like adding humans, drow, elves, giant penises, etc. Feral animals do not naturally occur in the Dragonlands continuity, that much I know. And what a slap in the face that would be for those of us that actually bother to follow the theme.

By adding a "become feral" option you would be forcing ALL players to be Lycan.

A 'ban from dream/ds checking feral state/auto ignore all/turn off and make walkable all' feature would be needed to keep normal players from having their normal to the theme gameplay ruined by a feral infestation.

I've seen roleplay places that don't bother to moderate their incoming members lose quality because of infestation of bad feral players.

If Ferals were added there would probably be a lot of this:
You enter the dream of _.
[#] Ferals aren't welcome here. Banned.
*You have been ejected from this dream.

And what makes you think that DEP hasn't already considered and turned down the idea in the beginning or after it was suggested the last few times? If Furcadia was intended to have ferals it would be called "Animalcadia", "Fourleggedcadia" or "Let's play dog" not "Furcadia".

Oh and please tell me what is so mystical about an unevolved dog. Does it lay mystical poo and eat mystical vomit?

[FaolinBainin]

Perhaps you should re-read my post.

What I think is fair is that any avatar that fits into the continuity should be able to be freely suggested and or implemented.
Bestial forms are part of the continuity so I don't know why you keep calling them ferals and responding only to that aspect. If you want a hunter avatar, go ahead an suggest it, however it's more of an occupation than a species or a transformation.

Like I said, Bestial forms do NOT break the continuity.

And as I suggested it as a digo item, it would not force ANYONE to do anything they didn't pay for.

I have no idea if DEP has considered it yet because I haven't come across any official statements about it specifically.

Again, I am not talking about ferals, I am talking about Bestial forms.
It's mystical because the dragonlands faq says it is as far as the furc continutiy is concerned.



This post has been edited by FaolinBainin: Nov 22 2003, 11:13 PM

[Youlanda]

Ferals walk on four legs not two, which makes them against the theme. If they were to be included under the mystic thing they'd be bipedal... and a bipedal animal with humanoid qualities is a furry/furre.

Go take a look at the Lycan in Talz's bookstore monsters thing. You'll notice it is bipedal anthropomphic...

Why should special interest groups get their own avatars?

And I still do not see what is so mystical about a dog. Is it the vomit eating that makes it so magical?

Why choose Ferals over Bears or some other non-theme-breaking avatar?

And creatures of the Mystic theme are always paid avatars.



This post has been edited by Youlanda: Nov 22 2003, 11:51 PM

[Wolf Redstar]

I think someone needs to go re-read the Furcadia welcoming message -- http://www.furcadia.com.

Or, alternatively, you could go here -- http://www.wolfhome.com.

WolfHome permits the two stages of evolvement: Chrinos and Wild forms, but only for two species so far - Lupine/Canid breeds and some types of Felines.
Thankfully, however, WolfHome is a lot more strictly run than Furcadia, so attempting any crap there will generallt get you banned for a certain period of time.
And doubley thankful - It's Pay-to-Play for a permanent account.

[Tegome Aburana]

Lycans would be hunted, ferals would go against Furcadia's theme... Maybe we should add chimeras instead? They walk on four legs -and- they're mystical! Pay no attention to the snake and deer head on that wolf, though...

[Tweak]

Chimeras sound like they're some sort of edible Japanese food.

[Snap Snap]

The last thing that should be added is the Chimera, unless it is done exactly as the Greeks designed it, they were the ones to come up with it. Lion head and front legs, goat head behind the lion head, goat back legs, and a snake for a tail. Please for the love of mythological accuracy, if by any chance it's added, get it right.